2019 Rule Change Proposals

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Re: 2019 Rule Change Proposals

Postby Peaks » Wed Oct 03, 2018 3:09 pm

Mitch_Gill wrote:I didn’t see this post, I would have voted for rule 3 idk if that would have mattered or not. I’ll bring it up next year. I really think that rule is dumb and restricts bad teams from becoming good, and helps the good teams stay on top. Hard to compete with usage and get good players when I’m missing close to 20% of my cap in penalties every year and the good team get an extra 10-% on top of that.


It adds a challenge for sure, especially if you focus on the rule itself, in a vacuum. But you also have other tools in your toolbox to get better. I've been on both sides of the coin, been a bad team and having less money, but it's fairly easy to cope with in most cases. Trading in the offseason or during the season can remove contracts and get you younger controllable talent that can more than make up for the hit. It's how this team got built - Judge, Springer, Shaw traded for cheaply in previous year's trades followed up by taking advantage of good farm drafts and trading for key pieces like Sale this year. It's not the only blueprint and it doesn't happen overnight and there is no guarantee if we didn't have this in place that you'd still be able to rebuild any easier or quicker.

This year, I'll have an extra 5M than I had last year. That's a great advantage. But I also have a lot of free agents leaving, some at really good value (Sale at 8.5M for example) that I won't be able to replicate or replace this offseason. I'll still have to work and likely spend all that money and still have a lesser team, maybe not even a playoff team without a lot of wheeling and dealing. And if I spend that extra 5M unwisely, it could end up shooting myself in the foot.

And some of it just being in the right place and the right time.

The penalties/rewards are a factor, but to act as if that is the only reason Team X can't get better or Team Y doesn't get bad in not correct in my mind. You took over a franchise that was habitually tinkered with no success and that's a hard hurdle to overcome, no matter what the rules are.
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Re: 2019 Rule Change Proposals

Postby Peaks » Wed Oct 03, 2018 3:11 pm

irishrebel2000 wrote:I agree 100%. Perhaps we would get more yes votes if we merely removed the penalties and kept the incentives ??


All you'd be doing is cutting with this approach is cutting the rule in half and taking away any incentive for a bad team to not tank.
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Re: 2019 Rule Change Proposals

Postby Mitch_Gill » Wed Oct 03, 2018 5:10 pm

Outlaws wrote:This year, I'll have an extra 5M than I had last year. That's a great advantage. But I also have a lot of free agents leaving, some at really good value (Sale at 8.5M for example) that I won't be able to replicate or replace this offseason. I'll still have to work and likely spend all that money and still have a lesser team, maybe not even a playoff team without a lot of wheeling and dealing. And if I spend that extra 5M unwisely, it could end up shooting myself in the foot.


I realize it’s possible to go from bad to good. I just think this rule does more harm then it does help. And to your point, you may have good people becoming free agents, and you may also have 5m extra that your right is only good if you spend it wisely... but I also have good people coming off contracts and I also have 12.5m less then you to spend because of the cap penalties/incentive so it’s even harder for me to retain guys. Idk how you guys don’t think an extra 12.5m isn’t a HUGE advantage and an unfair one at that. I realize the advantage of picking early in the farm draft and what not but those are all flyers. For the most part when it comes to FA draft/Auction money buys you sure things. But I missed the vote so it’ll have to be addressed again next year. I was just commenting saying I don’t think we should table this topic.
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Re: 2019 Rule Change Proposals

Postby Peaks » Wed Oct 03, 2018 5:37 pm

Mitch_Gill wrote:I realize it’s possible to go from bad to good. I just think this rule does more harm then it does help. And to your point, you may have good people becoming free agents, and you may also have 5m extra that your right is only good if you spend it wisely... but I also have good people coming off contracts and I also have 12.5m less then you to spend because of the cap penalties/incentive so it’s even harder for me to retain guys. Idk how you guys don’t think an extra 12.5m isn’t a HUGE advantage and an unfair one at that. I realize the advantage of picking early in the farm draft and what not but those are all flyers. For the most part when it comes to FA draft/Auction money buys you sure things. But I missed the vote so it’ll have to be addressed again next year. I was just commenting saying I don’t think we should table this topic.


No, 12.5M is a big difference.

It's also a big difference for you to be able to buy good players and sell them off for better pieces when others are building something else. You can make that up some of that difference in the right circumstances or even offset an entire year of losing for it. But you can't put a single dollar amount on that impact (although Bobby tries) when you look at the difference in caps at draft time.

Better farm picks, free agent picks in season, help offset the cost. Getting a 500K stud or useful piece or two for the next season sure helps, especially when that sort of players would be much more expensive in trade or the draft. It's a crapshoot, but it pays off only if you try.

Peburn would chime in "Win More!" which is a hard thing to hear when you are rebuilding, but if teams wouldn't sell everything off value and still try to compete, they can minimize things. I've had plenty of non-playoff teams that I could have tried to sell off and instead focused on trying to win and minimize things. Three years of being in a hole is hard, but you can have to dig out of that hole at some point too and no one here is going through anyone else a lifeline.

In and of itself, the money is different. My point is that it's not the only difference and certainly not all of the differences are disadvantages.

And I'm not trying to imply anything specific toward you or your franchise here Mitch. Just re-hashing the same Pros that have been posted every single time it's been brought up and voted to keep. The one sole Con is always, it's not fair to have that much of a difference between caps and it's a strong one. Maybe it depends on whether you are a glass half-full or -empty person. Maybe those teams that are newer don't like to be different.

And sure, we can bring up again next year too. It's only the third or fourth time it's been voted on. Enough people will get tired of it that we'll eventually cave. And that's fine too. I like the incentive aspect of it. It certainly has helped push me to get where I am. But clearly t's not for everyone.
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Re: 2019 Rule Change Proposals

Postby Mitch_Gill » Wed Oct 03, 2018 7:59 pm

And I would be all for potentially keeping the incentive part of it from a winning side of it. I just don’t like taking away cap space from losing teams. But that can be discussed again next year
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Re: 2019 Rule Change Proposals

Postby Black Sox » Thu Oct 04, 2018 7:39 am

I don't think its necessary because of the other rules we have such as the order for the free agent draft and the tie breaker for the auction. I like those two rules and do think they are necessary. In my opinion the win loss bonus penalty is overkill.
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Re: 2019 Rule Change Proposals

Postby Undertakers » Thu Oct 04, 2018 11:05 am

I am in the football equivalent of the BDBL - a league Jim started many years ago! Fun fact, I took over for Mike Glander after 1 year - the Salem Steers. I never moved the team, so I am the Salem Steers in the KRFL.

Anyway, the league has zero incentive to win, and we just had our trade deadline - it is early - week 4. A whole bunch of teams became sellers. Teams that are .500 sold off everything to get better draft picks. Teams one game out of first traded away their best players. Its bad for the league. I know some people are frustrated by the win/loss penalties, but it is real bad in leagues where there is no incentive to win. In the KRFL, if you don't have a championship team, you have no reason to try to be good that year.
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Re: 2019 Rule Change Proposals

Postby Black Sox » Thu Oct 04, 2018 11:27 am

Undertakers wrote:I am in the football equivalent of the BDBL - a league Jim started many years ago! Fun fact, I took over for Mike Glander after 1 year - the Salem Steers. I never moved the team, so I am the Salem Steers in the KRFL.

Anyway, the league has zero incentive to win, and we just had our trade deadline - it is early - week 4. A whole bunch of teams became sellers. Teams that are .500 sold off everything to get better draft picks. Teams one game out of first traded away their best players. Its bad for the league. I know some people are frustrated by the win/loss penalties, but it is real bad in leagues where there is no incentive to win. In the KRFL, if you don't have a championship team, you have no reason to try to be good that year.



Its a good thing the favorite always wins.
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Re: 2019 Rule Change Proposals

Postby Commish » Thu Oct 04, 2018 11:34 am

Funny story about that football league. Jim was so opposed to wildcards that he refused to allow any wildcards in that league. My team went 10-6 (I believe) in that first season and didn't make the playoffs. Nothing to show for our .625 winning percentage.

Years and years later, guess who voted in favor of adding a second wildcard to the BDBL?

:roll:
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Re: 2019 Rule Change Proposals

Postby Commish » Mon Oct 08, 2018 2:54 pm

Rulebook amended.

Let me know if there is any confusion.
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